Side feed, top feed or bottom feed

RebelAir said:

On the color change aspect of siphons and sides..Its just a simple case of having a spare bottle with water or the cleaning agent you prefer..and is only really required when going from dark to light colors..Light to dark its just a case of taking the bottle of, spray through any residual paint in the gun and then attach the new darker color and keep going, the lighter color will blend and disappear within seconds..It isn't necessary at all to have multiple brushes unless you plan to use gravity's for the job..many pro's do have multi gun setups because they may prefer gravity guns as it does speed up the process by about 10 seconds LOL, but if doing 30 shirts a day, or 100 tatts that small amount of time does add up to be fair but realistically your talking a loss of a few minutes of your day..Saying that when I was stuck with a gravity and my Anthem was down, got just as fast color changing but it did waste more paint..What a gravity can't do is keep on keeping on so time is also lost constantly stopping to refill you paint..and in that process of stopping tip dry occurs and slows you even more..Plus one gun and 20 paint bottles is much cheaper to set up and start a business than 20 guns for individual colors.

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Yes when I did shirts in Florida it would kill me cleaning out colors especially White or Black. It would double my time compared with the others with multiple gun setup. It would almost double my time. Of course it depended on the design. Believe me from experience a multi setup is best and the customer gets less frustrated. If you can't afford it like I couldn't then work you way up to it.


Paint on

Respectfully disagree..Don't know what airbrush you we're using when doing your shirts in Florida but I doubt it was a siphon which is my go to gun style and I know back to front, few here have ever even used them, I do extensively, from fine detail to full auto work and everything in between, nor do I understand why you would think someone was using Etac PS for temp tatts..Most temp tatt paints/inks are alcohol based..Not impossible that someone out there is using such but if so they won't last long on the skin. Sorry I can't just "believe you" in this. It is my main focus and has been for years and I can clean out my gravity as fast as I can my siphon..nearly..and again that is in the realm of seconds if done correctly but as I mention it does waste more paint. I do agree a multigun setup is a good idea but only because its a PITA to be constantly cleaning but the time wasted is negligible if done correctly. you mention a cple of times it would double your time..Doubling what to what? I have no issue pitting my experience and understanding on this subject with anyone but hope it doesn't offend that I disagree..I do consider myself, maybe vainly, one of the fastest freehand painters around and have developed that aspect to a fine art in itself as I have little time to waste when painting LOL

Hi @Al_dd To be fair when I used to do body painting and temp tattoo`s I would use a gravity and a side feed,depending on what I was doing ie large body painting or small tattoo`s depended on which AB.For speed there`s not a lot in it when you get used to it.Please please only use body paint as they come with certificates and breakdowns for allergies....keeps you covered

RebelAir said:

Respectfully disagree..Don't know what airbrush you we're using when doing your shirts in Florida but I doubt it was a siphon which is my go to gun style and I know back to front, few here have ever even used them, I do extensively, from fine detail to full auto work and everything in between, nor do I understand why you would think someone was using Etac PS for temp tatts..Most temp tatt paints/inks are alcohol based..Not impossible that someone out there is using such but if so they won't last long on the skin. Sorry I can't just "believe you" in this. It is my main focus and has been for years and I can clean out my gravity as fast as I can my siphon..nearly..and again that is in the realm of seconds if done correctly but as I mention it does waste more paint. I do agree a multigun setup is a good idea but only because its a PITA to be constantly cleaning but the time wasted is negligible if done correctly. you mention a cple of times it would double your time..Doubling what to what? I have no issue pitting my experience and understanding on this subject with anyone but hope it doesn't offend that I disagree..I do consider myself, maybe vainly, one of the fastest freehand painters around and have developed that aspect to a fine art in itself as I have little time to waste when painting LOL

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To answer your question I was using a Paasche VL3 with the number 3 head and needle. This was back in 1984 and Iwata Eclipse were just being developed. In fact Iwata just had sent Mark Rush my boss one to test. You are turning this into a pissing contest and I was only giving the best advice I could to help. Throwing the words no disrespect means diddly squat when boast on your own self abilities.

My best advice is to do a job and do it to the best of your abilities. You can make it work with any of these airbrushes you are asking about. All three are good choices so pick what you are comfortable with using and enjoy!


Paint on

LOL, Pissing contest? Really..because I state I can paint very fast and have found methods to clean my guns out quickly I'm boastful? LOL. Confident perhaps yes, boastful not at all, perhaps its just a case that you just have not found those same methods yet? You mentioned your experience and due to that experience you seem to think mine is incorrect? I mention no disrespect because I feel its the polite thing to do when disagreeing with someone who states Etac PS is a temp tatt ink and their post basically contradicts what I know is fact within my own ability when it comes to color changing, thus my quoting the "believe me" statement..I don't, because my own experience suggests its wrong..I simply stated that you can clean a gravity feed as fast as you can a siphon, you seem to think it doubles your time on a job and upsets customers..I disagree, but you obviously think my thoughts are either false or I'm lying and your correct on that supposition because it doubled your time.. Commercial painting has nothing to do with wasting a few minutes of your day cleaning. Its about how fast you can paint that design in the first place...Thats what separates most in that world...

I also mentioned and agreed that a multi set-up when using gravity is a good thing if going "commercial" in one of my first responses to the thread, but if using a siphon its not really required, thus I assume why many posted a siphon may be the posters need, though many will still choose to have a multi gun set-up, just as many these days use the Anthem as their go to and reduce that multi gun need and simply replace 20 guns with 20 paint bottles as its a much cheaper option, but yes they may also have a few guns on the go. But please look at it also with common sense. You loose that time again at the end of the day when you have 10 brushes to clean compared to one....I responded to you directly because I feel the information you have given someone isn't fully correct and was more focused on the Etac use in temp tatts, on other aspects I semi agree but only on the aspect that some desire no color changing needs at all for ease of use rather than for the wasting of time and thats where we obviously differ on opinion. More to the point, others though interested in that area of tatts may think your correct and waste their money buying Etac to do them if reading such threads in the future so that I corrected- because its simply incorrect..I personally think your quite a talented artist though so tried to show some respect when disagreeing with you and I did not personally attack you but seems these days if you disagree with someone, that's how they take it. To that I'd simply say some need to grow up but feel free to call me what you wish..Been called worse and find it amusing rather than confronting..

Okay folks this is getting a little out of hand .
As to the original poster I have seen body painters and t-shirt artist us all 3 styles mainly it is personnel preference and what airbrush style (gravity , siphon, or side feed) works best for you.
As you can see many have their own opinion on what works best , But that is what works best for them.
Me it is gravity feed , I use it on pretty much everything . Unless I am painting something like a ceiling then I do have a bottle feed.

So lets all cool down
Remember this is the spread the love forum

Sorry Mr Micron, happy to eat a little humble pie and apoligize if anything I stated was out of hand or not Spreading the love enough..Point is though, opinion is opinion, fact is fact, and am not at all angry or heated, slightly ammused but nothing beyond that personally to Airbrush Dreams. I actually respect him and he's ability. We must at times though be able to correct each other if we get something wrong or note something misleads as we are not here for our own ego's but to help beginners learn...I understand I come across brash at times, maybe even over confident but am not boastful. To be told I'm turning something into a pissing contest is ill directed and ill manered, all I care about is beginners as hopefully my past has shown, don't care though for other artists ego's as I'm not here to prop such up...I take it under your advice as I respect you that it is taking the thread into places it need not be so will not post any further on such..and do agree that what brush someone chooses to use is personal opinion and choice, I did not bring up the color change aspect and only tried to state that in that arena..It doesn't really matter and with experience one is just as fast as the other..But to state to use etac for tatts needs correction.

No worries I just received a report about this thread and wanted it to calm down ,
Yes we all have opinions and we may not always share the same one. so it is all good.
Yeah body paint for the human skin due to some folks might have a reaction to anything not designed just for the skin.
I would hate to think of someone using HOK on a body paint ... Ouch ...LOL

HOK body paint!! Lo Im sure someone out there has tried it!!

I got no problem and I never suggested the PS was a body paint or temp tattoo paint. If you had read closely I said because it was water based it might be safer on a person. Also I believe I stated that a siphon feed took a bit more time to clear out than a gravity. Plus I kind of remember saying all three guns were good choices it is a matter of what you feel comfortable with. I never ever said anyone was wrong. I also remember saying to look at actual body artist to see what they use.


Paint on

Fred, go read what you said..Was over this and was happy to leave it be as perhaps you should, but your now contradicting your own statements. Statements which I feel fair to disagree with and tried to do so politely, not to help you but to help others who don't know what is right and what is wrong...Its not about though what you said till it got to such comments as "pissing contest" and my apparent "boasting of my abilities" that's going beyond what was needed and I feel requires an apology but don't care if you do or you don't, not something I'll loose sleep over, my interest was helping beginners that may read such..You actually state "They are water based or use something like E'TAC PS that does not need solvent."..The fact is most tattoo paints are not paint..they are alcohol based inks, thus use solvents, solvents that are safe to the skin for most as alcohol is, though what is in Etac is NOT designed for skin, water based and water bourne are two different things.....and to remind you also you state "Side feed are good and with the bottle you can limit to one or two brushes but the do take a bit more to clean between colors."..that I also contradict as I disagree and can clean both within a similar time frame and that is withing about 10-20 seconds, it may increase your painting time, but not mine and if thats wrong for pointing out well perhaps you need to consider a different cleaning style. I do read things closely, and perhaps that's the issue but I have a duty of care as do all on this forum, especially those with experience to give the right advice, especially when peoples well being may be at risk from such a statement..The rest of your thoughts I basically agreed with a cple of times, doesn't matter what airbrush the poster chooses...Forums are to discuss and I am happy for someone to disagree with an opinion of mine as that is all it is. facts though are facts.I'm happy also to be told where one of my opinions may be different to anothers as I may learn something and if i get a fact wrong which no doubt I have numerous times over the years I actually appreciate when someone pulls me up on it....Feel free to have the last word as it seems that's what you desire...We could have left it alone after Micron suggested so...Perhaps close the thread...as I'm sick of people reading between the lines on things that don't exist and have no desire to continue a stupid discussion anyway...My point is clearly made..

RebelAir said:

Fred, go read what you said..Was over this and was happy to leave it be as perhaps you should, but your now contradicting your own statements. Statements which I feel fair to disagree with and tried to do so politely, not to help you but to help others who don't know what is right and what is wrong...Its not about though what you said till it got to such comments as "pissing contest" and my apparent "boasting of my abilities" that's going beyond what was needed and I feel requires an apology but don't care if you do or you don't, not something I'll loose sleep over, my interest was helping beginners that may read such..You actually state "They are water based or use something like E'TAC PS that does not need solvent."..The fact is most tattoo paints are not paint..they are alcohol based inks, thus use solvents, solvents that are safe to the skin for most as alcohol is, though what is in Etac is NOT designed for skin, water based and water bourne are two different things.....and to remind you also you state "Side feed are good and with the bottle you can limit to one or two brushes but the do take a bit more to clean between colors."..that I also contradict as I disagree and can clean both within a similar time frame and that is withing about 10-20 seconds, it may increase your painting time, but not mine and if thats wrong for pointing out well perhaps you need to consider a different cleaning style. I do read things closely, and perhaps that's the issue but I have a duty of care as do all on this forum, especially those with experience to give the right advice, especially when peoples well being may be at risk from such a statement..The rest of your thoughts I basically agreed with a cple of times, doesn't matter what airbrush the poster chooses...Forums are to discuss and I am happy for someone to disagree with an opinion of mine as that is all it is. facts though are facts.I'm happy also to be told where one of my opinions may be different to anothers as I may learn something and if i get a fact wrong which no doubt I have numerous times over the years I actually appreciate when someone pulls me up on it....Feel free to have the last word as it seems that's what you desire...We could have left it alone after Micron suggested so...Perhaps close the thread...as I'm sick of people reading between the lines on things that don't exist and have no desire to continue a stupid discussion anyway...My point is clearly made..

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Paint on

Al_dd said:

Hi guys. Looking to buy a new airbrush as compressor. But sure whether to get a bottom, top or side feed. Looking at the Eclipse range. It's going to be for body painting, both broader and finer detail. Just wondering what people think of the different types when it covers body painting? Also, any suggestions on a decent compressor to go with? Thanks heaps in advance

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I did a pinch of research and noticed that Chicago Airbrush Supply has starter kits for body art and all of them come with gravity feed. And for paints most artists suggested water based Acrylic paints because they are cheaper and easier to was off. Best of luck to you and hope to see some of your work soon! [emoji106]


Paint on

On a last note and to the poster of this thread. please do your own research and please do not use anything besides APPROVED Body Art paint. Using any old water based acrylics because they are cheap will potentially see you causing a massive skin reaction to the person your painting on and a possible lawsuit. Also if using latex body paint understand that you must leave large enough area's unpainted to allow the skin to breath and sweat to reduce the chances of heattroke as not doing so has actually harmed people in the past. If doing temp tattoo's say at a fair or market, ensure you use APPROVED temp tattoo ink and PS Don't get the two mixed up as otherwise that body painting you just did may not come of for a week or few LOL. On the airbrush aspect it appears you've ordered the right thing so enjoy and hope you do well..All the rest is just hot air...

Thanks for all the useful advice everyone. Learnt heaps. Definitely steered me in the right direction. Would have ended up with a pretty bad setup otherwise.

:toesies:

Al_dd said:

Thanks for all the useful advice everyone. Learnt heaps. Definitely steered me in the right direction. Would have ended up with a pretty bad setup otherwise.

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That's what this forum does best, give varying views and opinions of real life applications, not just what the manufacturer states or the book on the subject states.
Here's hoping that your partner is happy with your decision