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Delay of paint spray

Discussion in 'Troubleshooting!' started by McGrFx, Jan 10, 2017.


  1. McGrFx

    McGrFx Young Tutorling

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    Hey All, New member. I am having issues troubleshooting my airbrushs. On one, I get paint when I press down on trigger for air only. On the other I dont get a smooth release of paint with trigger pull, I can pull all the way back and paint delays about 1-2 seconds before is sprays or spits out. Both have been thoroughly cleaned. I cant fix, any ideas?
  2. twood

    twood Mac-Valve Maestro! Very Likeable!

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    What kind of brush and what paints are you trying to use?
    For the paint spraying without pulling back, the needle might not be enough forward allowing this to happen or you have a chunk of paint in the tip stopping a proper seal. Even after a cleaning, there could still be a piece of dirt or paint....
    I use a loop (magnifying glass) to check.
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  3. DaveG

    DaveG Needle-chuck Ninja Very Likeable!

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    1st, is this Tom? If so, hello!

    The brush that sprays right away, no trigger pull back - not many options to explore - either the needle is not all the way forward, as described above, or in the worst case, your nozzle is cracked. So either debris, or a cracked nozzle... Either way, it may be easiest to replace nozzle.

    The one with delay - again, not really too many options there. Paint is drawn forward by vacuum over the nozzle created by airflow - If paint is not moving forward, chances are you have a vacuum leak - probably around the nozzle. I should also add ( sorry, answering like this is Tom:), who already got these answers elsewhere) - that poor paint consistency could also be the culprit - too thick for the needle/nozzle combo, or too large a pigment could also cause this type of problem.
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2017
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  4. matty171

    matty171 Air-Valve Autobot!

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    bit more info on brush required then some one who has the sane brush cant direct you better, but as mentioned already sounds like a cleaning is in order and again as mentioned you may need to reduce your paint further


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
  5. markjthomson

    markjthomson Very happy! Staff Member Mod

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    Hey there, I won't add more because I don't have anything to add... :) Hey what I will ask is pop along to the intro section and say Hi. What part of the world are you in? What gear do you use? What do you paint? That sort of thing. Here's the link.

    http://www.airbrushforum.org/introductions/

    Cheers Mark
  6. McGrFx

    McGrFx Young Tutorling

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    Sorry. I am using a Master Performance Pro Multipurpose G22 and G222 0.3 mm set. Creatix Opaque Water based and yes using reducer. I have tried high and low pressures and little to a lot of reducer. Same issues. Both were working fine until the needle bent and i replaced everything. Now neither work properly.
  7. JackEb

    JackEb Dragon Hunter Staff Member Admin

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    replaced 'everything' ? so you've replaced the needle and Nozzle ?
    if you only replaced the needle then you could potentially have a cracked/flared nozzle

    sorry for the additional questions but in order to figure out what the problem is we need all the info not just some :)
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  8. McGrFx

    McGrFx Young Tutorling

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    yes, I replaced both needle and tip together for both.
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  9. DaveG

    DaveG Needle-chuck Ninja Very Likeable!

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    OK, gonna ask you to be a little more specific - when you say you replaced everything, what does that mean? When the needle bent, was it on the brush that sprays when you touch the trigger?

    I have a few of that type brush, and they all use a small o-ring seal on the nozzle. While this sounds like a good idea, they can be temperamental. If you tighten the nozzle too much, it places the nozzle too far inside the air cap - it should be even, or just protruding a tad when viewed from the side. Not tight enough, and you have a vacuum leak...
  10. JackEb

    JackEb Dragon Hunter Staff Member Admin

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    ok.......... here is an exploded pic or your brush......
    which 'tip' did you change ?

    oops, hang on..... technical issues
    :confused:

    Capture.JPG
  11. McGrFx

    McGrFx Young Tutorling

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    Ok, yes. I didnt replace every piece. More specifically just the needle and nozzle tips. I do know about the tiny o-ring. The first set i replaces, i made the mistake of breaking off inside the air cap. I was able to get that out, but when i used a new set, I made sure not to over tighten. As far as the other brush goes, i didnt have that problem. I replaced that set by accident thinking it was the bent brush, however after i put the originals back on that one, I started have sputtering and paint release with pressing trigger for just air.
  12. McGrFx

    McGrFx Young Tutorling

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    I replaced 2, 3, 4 and 5 for each. Thats what came with my set. So i changed them as sets. I wasnt going to put a 0.2 needle in a 0.3 nozzle and tip.
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  13. JackEb

    JackEb Dragon Hunter Staff Member Admin

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    No worries, just checking to make sure we're all talking about the same bits :)
  14. DaveG

    DaveG Needle-chuck Ninja Very Likeable!

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    Ok, got s chance to take some picts to help run through this stuff -

    On both brushes, these will be things to check. On the one that paint will start flowing right away with trigger push - there is no alternative to the needle is not sealing within the nozzle (for one reason or another) I am going to assume there is some sort of debris inside the nozzle. I would fill the cup with either cleaner, or water, and start spraying. At the same time, loosen the needle chuck, and draw the needle back by pulling on the back end of it - maybe about 1/8th inch. Push it back in with a slight twisting motion. Repeat several times to see if you can stop the flow of spray when the needle is all the way in. If the spray stops, tighten the needle chuck, and you should be good to go. This will sometimes help to expel debris easier than just spraying...

    On the other, there are several things to check. Sometimes air can leak from the head assembly where it mates to the body. If the leak is big enough, it will hinder performance. I check this by putting a drop or two of cleaner (or soapy water) at the seam where the two meet, and apply air by pushing down on the trigger. You will see bubbles like this pict -
    air-leak1.jpg
    If you have bubbles, either add teflon tape to the threads, or an old trick is to use bee's wax (chapstick will work also).

    Next to check is the nozzle, as paint flow is generated by a vacuum caused by airflow over the very tip of the nozzle. You will want the tip of the nozzle to be at least flush with the air cap, or even better, protruding just past the face of the air cap.
    nozzle-aircap1.jpg
    If the nozzle is below the face of the air cap, it can allow air to enter the tip, causing back pressure. The option here to correct, is use the tip wrench to loosen the nozzle a little (this may then allow a vacuum leak at the base of the nozzle, which may be corrected with bee's wax or chapstick :)) You may also try replacing with another nozzle, as there is a fair bit of tolerance (or slop) in the brushes within this price range. This brings me to the next area to check - the base of the nozzle. If air is allowed to pass this critical area, you will have a problem :). It is possible the tiny o-ring is cut, or mangled, so I would be tempted to eliminate the possibility of leak here by using wax or chapstick on the nozzle threads (careful not to allow either to get into the nozzle, just on the threads)...
    nozzle-airleak1.jpg

    The other thing to look for will be the nozzle alignment with the air cap. The tip of the nozzle should ideally be centered in the opening of the air cap.
    point-zero-tip-off.jpg
    On several of the brushes I have of this type, I have been able to loosen the nozzle with the tip wrench, and then snug it back down while pushing in the direction I wanted it to go. Might take a few try's, but I have been able to get them at least much closer...

    I hope this helps, and that you are able to identify the issue, and get yourself back into the game asap!
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2017
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  15. Squishy

    Squishy Queen Clown Slayer Mod

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    Can only agree with the others, but would just like to add that if the Createx paint you are using is the original Createx, then this is a fabric paint, meant to be used with .5 nozzles or larger, at pressures of up around 60 psi. It can be used for other things, but will need a lot of reduction, and isn't ideal for that nozzle size. It is likely blocking your nozzles and giving the issues mentioned. If you are cleaning the nozzles a lot, there is also the possibility that they are becoming flared, particularly with this price bracket ss materials tend to be softer. Flaring is hard to see, but will not allow the needle to seat properly.

    If you are not needing a fabric paint, I suggest getting another kind. If you want to stick with createx, then look st Wicked which is an all round multi surface paint (including textiles) or if you just want to concentrate on paper/board etc try Createx Illustration. Other fave paints on the forum include E'tac, Trident, and Golden amongst others.

    Once you are sure your nozzles are good, then different paint should make life much easier. If you do stuck with the createx brand, and aren't already using I then I highly recommend the 4012 reducer, as well as reducing it also helps with flow and minimising tip dry, and doubles up as a good cleaner. Once you have your ratios nailed, you shouldn't get blockages, and a final spray of 4012 at the end of a session should keep your nozzles clean.
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  16. McGrFx

    McGrFx Young Tutorling

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    Thanks for the tip. I will try to see if increasing my reduction works.
  17. McGrFx

    McGrFx Young Tutorling

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    Dave, Thank you for the detailed explanations and snapshots. A lot of this makes sense and I will check on these later on tonight and let you know what comes of it.:( I also want to make a correction, I have a mix of stuff down there. So from what I mentioned before, I just wanted to add that the paint I have most of right now is the cheapo depot brand ..US Art Supply opaque water bases acrylic formulation. I do have a few createx and one or two wicked.
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  18. DaveG

    DaveG Needle-chuck Ninja Very Likeable!

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    aside from the spray on initial trigger push, your paint could very well be causing your problems. With those brands it is possible to thin them to a good consistency, yet have trouble due to pigment size... Depending on which Createx, as well as the Wicked, you could also have trouble with a small-ish tip, and they reduce better using Createx product(s), rather than water, which can actually cause more problems... All of these things are simply part of the learning curve with airbrushing, and part of what we have all gone through ;) Keep at it, and we'll get it all sorted out :thumbsup:.
  19. McGrFx

    McGrFx Young Tutorling

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    Well I have been using reducer instead of water to reduce them. Would that cause a problem with these paints?
  20. DaveG

    DaveG Needle-chuck Ninja Very Likeable!

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    I have only used the reducer with Createx products, and have no experience with it in other paints... I find the Createx products act more like solvent based paints, so try to keep them separate...

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