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Real Chrome FX

Discussion in 'Open Bar!' started by Vladimir, Jan 6, 2018.


  1. Vladimir

    Vladimir Detail Decepticon!

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    Real Chrome FX is really cool looking effect, good addition to other custom paint techniques.
    I think about it, but this FX needs certain equipment and chemicals. Does anyone uses (used) it?

    It requires smth like that
    https://alsacorp.com/chrome-fx-machines-spray-chrome-paint-systems/

    chrome.jpg

    Any thoughts?
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  2. basepaint

    basepaint Air-Valve Autobot! Very Likeable!

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    Looks like a nice system and the effect looks great not a fan of the cost for me
  3. Vladimir

    Vladimir Detail Decepticon!

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    The cost is unreal for me:) The cost is for holywood hills based custom painters, it seems.
    It's just a link for looking at the system, didn't wanted to search for smth similar.
  4. Robbyrockett2

    Robbyrockett2 Air-Valve Autobot!

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    Alsa chromeFX is really nice. I would compare the finish to vacuum deposition ( what you see on chromed plastic)
    You do not need that high priced machine, that is just for convenience and doing it regularly, it just mixes the chemicals for you, It's meant for production work. The $500 chrome fx setup is the same, you just have to do the mixing yourself and use your own spray guns.
    Alsa Easychrome is good too, in fact Alsa is one of those companies you can pretty much go off what they say for all their products. The claims are true.

    I know of rim repair companies that use those two products to repair real chromed rims, you need a very very keen eye to spot the repair. Most people couldn't.
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  5. Vladimir

    Vladimir Detail Decepticon!

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    No, that machines don't mix anything:) They work just as any other do due to the chemical process used. I've put the link as it was bookmarked, there was no need to search for another manufacturer of the machine:) I don't know what to pay eight K$.
    The difference in machines may be within type of chemical solution flow (self flow and pressurized flow(in the link)) and in chroming gun (internal mix and external mix/better variant/). External mix - is two headed gun, old variant. It's now they started mixing two solutions in the guns head, but it's better to mix the solutions on the surface.

    I'm going to make my own machine. I understand how it works and what is required for building the machine. First thing is cash:)
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  6. Robbyrockett2

    Robbyrockett2 Air-Valve Autobot!

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    Meaning this..... Does the same as the machine. The double sprayer is for part A and B to mix it like the machine does. But the machine also mixes the water into the A B an C parts for you. So you don't have to.
    The basecoat and topcoat can be done with normal spray guns instead of the preval.
    I may not be understanding what you're saying...sorry if that is the case

    But yes, a two headed spray gun, a spray gun for base, a spray gun for topcoat and a spray gun for water would accomplish the same thing as the machine does.
    The machine just makes it convenient.
    Screen Shot 2018-01-08 at 1.17.27 AM.png
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2018
  7. Robbyrockett2

    Robbyrockett2 Air-Valve Autobot!

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    Oops, that one doesn't do that part.

    But yes I agree, no need for an 8K machine.
    you could probably do the same thing by holding a spray gun in each hand if you wanted to.
  8. Vladimir

    Vladimir Detail Decepticon!

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    Those 4 vessels contain: 1 - activator, 2&3 - chroming solution, 4 - distilled water. Water is used to clean the surface between operations, it's not added to the solution while applying the chemicals.
    Definitely, it's not worth 8K, at least here. If it's sold for that price in the US that means people buying it. This price is not changed for many years.

    The trick is you must adjust both heads for equal material flow, it's extremely important.
    Definitely, one could use two guns, but it's more convenient to make a coupled gun, it's rather simple. I've got ready to use two headed gun from Paasche, though. I don't know if I'll use this or make make own custom gun.
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  9. Robbyrockett2

    Robbyrockett2 Air-Valve Autobot!

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    Activator and chroming solution are concentrates. You have to mix them with water before you use them. Once mixed with water theyre only good for so many hours.
    I haven't used the machine, Just the kit I posted. Unless trying to chrome a whole car though, that kit is fine.
    Loading the machine though is the same process, you have to add water to the solutions.

    I think you thought I was talking about a different brand, and I thought you thought the machine was necessary. Plus I was originally thinking the machine did one more function than it actually does, so that was wrong and added to the confusion. I'm not sure, but I had confused your meaning somewhere, sorry, my fault.

    Anyways since we are now on the same page.

    If you have a two headed gun and regular guns than you probably are all set. That's all you need.
    The actual sprayer atomization and such doesn't matter all that much (the process works just as well with that plastic spray bottle)
    So I would think the best way would be to couple two guns like you said. Even some super cheap ones possibly.

    The only concern I can think of is this; All of the systems use either plastic or stainless steel. So you .....might..... Need to use guns for the solution that the fluid will only contact stainless steel. I'm really not sure if non-stainless is to not spoil the process, or simply to make the gun durable because the solution is mostly water when it's ready to spray. That said, you can find dual head all stainless spray guns for about $150 US


    My question to you is; Do you actually plan to use the Alsa chemicals, or are you planning to make up your own?

    The special part about alsa is actually not their chroming solution but their base and topcoats. They have better adhesion to the midcoat than anything else.
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  10. Vladimir

    Vladimir Detail Decepticon!

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    I know we need to prepare the solution before using the machine. I wanted to say, that there's nothing special in that machine. You need to buy some special parts and that's it all about.

    Definitely, you can do without the machine. Machine makes convenience at work and precise amount of chemicals applied.
    What you've written is OK, you haven't confused anything. We've understood each other completely.

    Yes, I have all the guns.
    I think to make my own gun from two cheap, besides two headed I have. You need to put them body to body, make two triggers as one and do some job on the spray heads, everything is rather simple.

    I thought of that (plastic/stainless steel). What I plan is buying big polyethylene "bottles" (actually big water filters) and polyurethane hoses for the system. Only thing remains is little space in the paint passage in the gun, but I think it's OK, as many of cheap guns feature stainless steel spray nozzle and needle. Many people use these cheap guns and more over as I can see from Alsa page, they use cheapo coupled guns (orange box system).
    Paasche chroming gun is made of stainless steel. So, I think this issue is solved.

    No, I do not plan to use Alsa products:) For their pricing you know... I think to work for myself, not Alsa:)

    They sell here all the solutions ready to use, it's not a problem at all. And I think to make my own. I know the technology it seems.

    I've read about Alsa's coats. It's important to have good adhesion, but I think it's not only they are who know how to make good adhesion between all the layers.
    I know people who sell their technology including different ways of making good adhesion. When I'll be ready, I'll buy that.
    And I have my thoughts for the experiments. We have some chemicals in autobody repair lines to experiment with the adhesion;)
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  11. Robbyrockett2

    Robbyrockett2 Air-Valve Autobot!

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    Oh Yeah! we are definitely on the same page! I somehow knew you had the chemical part figured out.
    If you find a good way to do the base and top Where it's actually durable like alsa I want to know. I can't figure that part out.
    Each of the other system manufacturers don't have as good a reputation for durability

    One even tells you. Ours fails a crosshatch adhesion test, but no worries....just pile on the topcoat it will be ok. LOL
  12. Vladimir

    Vladimir Detail Decepticon!

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    What do you mean by saying "to do the base and top"? o_O Honestly, it's strange question from you:) Explain what you mean, please!
    I don't understand what's there can be not durable. Only things that can be changed are "cups" for the solution. I see no reason to use expensive stainless steel, polyethylene will do pretty good, it's neutral to the chemicals used, the chemicals themselves are delivered in PE or PP. The pressure used in the cups I've heard of is 1.5bar max. Water filter body can be used at 6bar. So you understand what I'm saying:)

    Those guys selling their technology have shown their adhesive tests, everything is OK. BTW, they have different ways for making good adhesion. They cover the cars, give live classes. But all I need is tricks for the adhesion. Chemical part is OK, I think.
    One weird way for adhesion is using gas burner:D

    My poor knowledge of English pushes me towards finding the meaning for what is "just pile on the topcoat it will be ok. LOL":(
  13. Robbyrockett2

    Robbyrockett2 Air-Valve Autobot!

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    To make the black base coat and clear coat have good adhesion to the chrome.
    Companies other than alsa, often these layers don't adhere.
    Some companies tell you that their product wont adhere very good.
    They tell you to just put many layers of clear on top. Which isn't really helping.


    They flame treat the basecoat on some?
    I don't think they would flame treat the chrome part...?
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  14. Vladimir

    Vladimir Detail Decepticon!

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    Definitely, clear wouldn't help if chrome layer isn't bonded to the previous layer.
    So one of the possible tricks is propane burner flame treating the surface before activating it, which is one step before application the chroming. It might work for some not big and not complicated surfaces, I suppose. I think, it's better to think over chemicals that can be used for making better adhesion.
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  15. Robbyrockett2

    Robbyrockett2 Air-Valve Autobot!

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    I agree flame treatment I've done, but only on PVC and ABS. Had no Idea it could help with urethane base coats.
    Yes it needs to be done chemically I think as well. Then I think maybe a 2k clear designed for rims or other polished surfaces on top would probably be great. Just have to figure out the adhesion to basecoat. Now you gave me a research project.
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  16. Vladimir

    Vladimir Detail Decepticon!

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    I saw guys doing flame treatment to urethane lines.

    We must find materials withing automotive refinishing lines that give the best adhesive properties. For research project I have some materials in my mind and I think something will work. I can imagine that you've got some materials supplied for your "faking" custom works in your mind to experiment with besides urethanes;)
    I'm pretty sure that solution for good adhesion is simple. Guys selling their technologies were not born as chroming gods. They were just experimenting before we started thinking of it:) Knowledge always ruled!
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