Beginner choice: S&H Silverline 0.2, PS-270 or HP-BH shady deal?

[Chipotle]

Did you mean the Bartsharp 183 or 186 If you meant the 187 then I wouldn't. I am only recommending the 183 and 186. They both have the H&S nozzle system. The only problem with this scenario is that there is a 6 to 8 week waiting list for one of them. Demand was so high when they introduced them, they sold out within a couple of weeks. If you live in the UK then give me a personal reply and I'll get mine to you so that you can try one out. If you like it pay me half the price of a new one. If not just send it back.

Right well spotted. I am going to edit the post above. I went for the 187 because it's available and I thought "hey except for the mac valve looks the same!".
Thanks for the offer, it's really kind. I just don't have the compressor, the spray boot, the colors and the models yet I need to bring them back from Italy and that's going to take months because of my unpredictable schedule.

EDIT: just found out I can edit only if nobody replied or maybe I can edit only the last post

 

[JackEb]

I have avoided recommending other brushes to keep from confusing things - figured it would be easier to stick with what you are already looking at. If there are other brushes you want to consider, there is a very good chance I either have one or have had one before .

View attachment 61801

oh now you're just showing off !!

 

[JackEb]

Right well spotted. I am going to edit the post above. I went for the 187 because it's available and I thought "hey except for the mac valve looks the same!".
Thanks for the offer, it's really kind. I just don't have the compressor, the spray boot, the colors and the models yet I need to bring them back from Italy and that's going to take months because of my unpredictable schedule.

EDIT: just found out I can edit only if nobody replied or maybe I can edit only the last post

there is a time limit of 15 - 20 min, (I cant remember) to edit a post.

 

[JackEb]

Edited:

@JackEb: I think I can stretch my budget up to £150-160 for the aribrush. This is the compressor, I think it's good enough and that's the air hose, any advice abou the hose or the adapters? I'll use acrylic paints, GW colors or other brands, maybe Kimera or Liquitex so the thinner should be something along these lines. Maybe later I'll try some oils but I am not totally sure.


Everybody many thanks for the advices I hope I didn't sound too stubborn or on the defensive. It's a big effort deciding what to buy to begin this journet with and I am trying to make a good decision without rushing it. I really like the PS-270 but if I decide it's too much of a risk I might go for the Iwata eclipse 0.3/0.4 if the BH it's too expensive to buy original. Please feel free to give any sort of advice or link you think might be useful

The compressor you linked to will do you fine for your requirements at the moment, I wouldn't plan on doing primer through a large nozzle but for the miniatures you are planning on doing it will cope well.

I agree with DaveG about the external MAC on the airhose, it essentially provides micro control to ALL airbrushes you wish to plug into it. Saving you $$ because you no longer need to look at airbrushes with built in MAC valves (like the BH you originally suggested)

I don't think anyone thinks you sound stubborn. asking lots of questions is the only way you'll get answers and when you first start out there are questions aplenty and even more that you didn't think about, so when you start asking questions you'll get more questions (like mine re compressors) to make sure you are heading in the right direction and not wasting money.

 

[Chipotle]

After sleeping on it I think the PS-270/286 is the most sensible choice.
I might get another model without the MAC valve but I won't save much money considering that is unlikely I will get another airbrush (yeah let's come back on this in a couple of years to see how that goes ).

Now question time:
-is the ps-270 the same as the ps-286 just with a different needle set-up?
-if that is the case what do I need to buy to switch the needle? Needle and?
-I read in another post that the ps-270 can even support the ps-770 needle setup, or even use some Iwata replacement parts. Did I just imagine that?
-What's the usage of sub 0.2mm tools? I'm just curious, the general consensus is that practice overcome some of the technical limits of the tool (like "sniping").

Just asking because I am thinking about buying the ps-270, use the 0.3 set-up for a while then move to 0.2 when I know enough about my paints/reduction and my workflow. I'm asking about the sub 0.2mm just because since it's cheap(er) I might want to play with it in the future (couple of years?). To be totally logic I should buy the ps-286 THEN buy the 0.2 needle set-up, but I found reviews mostly about the ps-270, can't find many about the 286.

 

[JackEb]

@DaveG is the guru that mentioned the interchangeability of parts between the PS and the Iwata, and if he says something is possible then you can believe it

and yes, we’ll come back in 12 months and revisit this thread and see how many brushes you’ve added to your collection. Anything more than one gives you an immediate visitor pass to the AAD group

 

[DaveG]

There are a few differences between the PS270 and PS289. They are mostly cosmetic, though. If you want to start with a .3 set up with flexibility to convert later on, you should go with the PS289. Once you feel comfortable with the brush, there are several ways to change sizes. You can purchase a nozzle, needle, and nozzle cap in .2, or you can purchase the entire head assembly and a needle. Changing the entire head would be my choice, as the nozzles are quite small. Yes, you can even go with a PS770 head and needle.

You put in the time learning the brush, and I am not real sure you will ever need to convert, but that is another story. Although, I do know you will eventually buy the PS770 - it will be irresistible.

 

[Than]

1st - Air-craft.net, and Everything Airbrush should be two places you get to know well if you are in the area of the UK.

2nd - I will dispel the myth that the Silverline is easier to clean than the other two on your list. It simply isn't. It is true that it is easier to remove the nozzle, but this does not equate to cleaning. The paint path is longer on the H&S compared to the other two listed, and therefore holds more color to clean out. In addition, the stacked disk needle packing in the H&S is pretty notorious for allowing paint to get into the back of the body, and takes a long time to clean completely when just flushing between colors. That packing is also about the hardest one to get adjusted correctly compared to the other two - which are the same as each other.

All three are good brushes, and all three can successfully be used to do the type of work you are wanting to do. Unfortunately, personal preferences will make deciding which one is right for you a bit of a stretch. Having all of them, I will say that the HP-BH is probably the best brush in the bunch, but I find the PS270 easier to use. Now, for me, the 270 is on the large side, so I tend to go with the HP-BH far more often. For me, the H&S brushes just don't feel like they offer the same sort of response that I get from the Japanese brushes, so they tend to remain in the case far more often.

I agree with H&S has long paint path but the stacked disk needle packing work well and flushing clean enough when properly diluted color.
But adjustable needle packing screw set in iwata can collect color. You can't screw needle packing fit in body because it's very tight. Then it has small gap which color come thru needle packing spiral. Sometime I pull trigger, needle chucking guide will twist causing needle packing screw set loosen.

 

[DaveG]

I agree with H&S has long paint path but the stacked disk needle packing work well and flushing clean enough when properly diluted color.
But adjustable needle packing screw set in iwata can collect color. You can't screw needle packing fit in body because it's very tight. Then it has small gap which color come thru needle packing spiral. Sometime I pull trigger, needle chucking guide will twist causing needle packing screw set loosen.

I don't know Than... the issues with H&S needle packing stacks are fairly well documented, and are relatively easy to find searching around the internet. I have remedied the issue on several of my H&S brushes by trimming the lip of the retaining cup, to expose at least half of the 1st teflon washer. The issue you describe with Iwata (I remember when you posted about it) describes a packing screw that is irregular. In the Iwata system the packing works by being pressed against the inside of the body cavity to create compression against the needle. There can be no gap, and no space to collect color. I can assure you, I have never once had an Iwata packing screw "twist" on it's own in any of the @75 Iwata's I have in my collection - as long as it was adjusted anywhere near correctly.

 

[Chipotle]

Hi guys I found that store that sells in ca $. It's stupid cheap but I might incurr into cutoms fees but it will be cheaper still than buying in UK.

WEIRD STORE LINK

Does anybody knows it?

EDIT: ok it's irrelevant that it's selling in ca $.

 

[Kim McCann]

Hi guys I found that store that sells in ca $. It's stupid cheap but I might incurr into cutoms fees but it will be cheaper still than buying in UK.

WEIRD STORE LINK

Does anybody knows it?

EDIT: ok it's irrelevant that it's selling in ca $.

I had to do a search on their site, and they do sell airbrush stuff, but it wasn't part of the link you put up. It just goes to their homepage, that was selling general housewares. So your post might have made people think you were spamming. You might want to show the full link to what you were talking about. There are a bunch of different models on their site.

As for the site... I've never heard of them. They seem to resemble Harbor Freight. They have some $20 brushes on there that are pretty clearly among the Chinese knockoffs. As I mentioned above, the problem with those brushes is quality control. You might luck out and get a really great brush that sprays much like the Iwata or Creos that it is trying to emulate, but you risk getting something that barely works or sprays terribly. It's luck of the draw really.

I have had a few cheap brushes in my collection, and honestly, none of them lasted more than a week or two, and one broke on arrival. I wouldn't recommend them, especially for a beginner who doesn't know if their troubles are themselves, or the brush. I would strongly encourage them to go with one of the less expensive models from a well known manufacturer. But it's up to you.

I would be careful about that site myself however. No address or phone number listed anywhere and some very suspicious English on the about us page. Seems a bit shady to me. I'd probably be more likely to use ebay than that site. At least there I have recourse if something isn't shipped.

Maybe someone else knows them tho and can vouch for them.

 

[Chipotle]

@Kim McCann: I had the same feeling but was a bit too much excited about the price. It's weird you couldn't find the ps-270, maybe it's already sold out, they have lots of Iwata though. Anyway doesn't matter since I'm ditching that site. Thanks for your opinion