W500, what do we think?

Squishy

Queen Clown Slayer
Couldn't wait to get my hands on this stuff, but after using it for a little bit, am not sure what I think. I love how it dries quicker, and cures tougher (great as I am hoping to be transporting stuff to a paintshop for clearing in the future, not good for erasing enthusiasts I imagine), but after reading that it practically eliminates tip dry, I have to say I'm disappointed. I don't notice any difference at all between the W100 and the 500 as far as tip dry goes. I've used it the same way I used the W100, and also tried playing with different ratios and pressure, but unless I'm missing a trick, I don't see any difference. I never have a problem with white, but black and some colours usually give me annoying tip dry, so I eagerly chucked some in the gun, not expecting it to disappear, but to improve, but it didn't. So either my tip dry isn't much of a problem in the first place, and the W500 can't improve on it, or it's fallen a bit short of my expactations in that area. I'd be interested to hear what you guys think of it.
 
I had some given to me at the airbrush getaway, but have not used it much yet. You are right a out drying faster and harder through. One place it does shine, it allows you to lay a base coat of your highlight color, then spray other layers over it, then erase. Your base highlight color doesn't erase off the board, unless you really erase the hell out of it. For this technique I use the standard illustration reducer on the upper layers that I want to erase. :)
 
Dry tip sucks monkey A**!!!! I was extremely angered today with it..seemed like every 2-3 minutes, I had to stop and clean off tip. I was getting really pissed, thought it was me, glad to know, that it wasnt. *oh, and I agree, even thought it was worse, with the Wicked detail black, and smoke black anyways**
 
Theres been a lot of talk about it, with these same issues, on other forums. I have some, doesn't seem too much different to me, as far as tip dry goes, but the other benefits are cool.

But then the illustration paint was supposed to almost eliminate tip dry too, yeah right.

Only thing I have heard repeated though is to mix your paint/reducer and let it set and work for 15-20 minutes. Who the hell does that? Maybe if you mix a bunch of colors ahead of time for a project. I tend to mix and adjust on the fly. I have to assume most others do as well.


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the W500 seems like an improvement over the W100 to me. There seems to be a little less tip dry, but, as mentioned, there is also the faster drying, better spray quality (IMO), easier color mixing, and no beading up. One of my biggest complaints with the W100 was that mixed colors tended to separate very quickly with Wicked anyway, and adding W100 just made matters worse. Plus, to get the best performance with the W100, you had to let it "work in" to the paint for a few minutes before spraying. The W500 doesn't seem to need that induction time. Tip dry is inevitable, whether with uros or waterbase paints. It's just a fact of airbrushing life. To me, the Wicked detail tip dry is well within the "acceptable" range. I started airbrushing waaaaay back with the original formula Auto Air, with the cloudy, viscous "reducer". Even using the Fantastik/Windex reducers, you were lucky to get 10 seconds of uninterrupted spray. Now, it's just muscle memory/force of habit to clean the tip after spraying for a few seconds. For a long time, I refused to buy any more Createx products because of the constant disappointments with the Auto Air line. It wasn't until I interned at Dru Blairs school and got free access to the Wicked detail paints that I was even willing to give them a chance. I still think E'Tac sprays a ton better, but I do like the Wicked detail/ Illustration color palate better (OK, the copied from Holbien color palate)
 
Like Draggin I think that the paint stays mixed better with the W500 vs the W100.
But Tip dry is the nature of the beast . Even HOK gives tip dry some times more so than the waterbased stuff.
But I have found mixing 1 drop W 500 with 2 drop W100 gives me better results.
 
Only thing I have heard repeated though is to mix your paint/reducer and let it set and work for 15-20 minutes. Who the hell does that? Maybe if you mix a bunch of colors ahead of time for a project. I tend to mix and adjust on the fly. I have to assume most others do as well.


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I hadn't heard that wmlepage. I might give it a try just in the interest of being thorough, but like you I mix on the fly, and to be honest I'm probably too impatient to do that all the time.
 
... One of my biggest complaints with the W100 was that mixed colors tended to separate very quickly with Wicked anyway, and adding W100 just made matters worse....
I forgot to mention that Draggin, I found less separation too, and also with some colours, I found the W100 would settle at the bottom of the cup, leaving the paint sat on top of it. The W500 is much better in that department.

Like Draggin I think that the paint stays mixed better with the W500 vs the W100.
But Tip dry is the nature of the beast . Even HOK gives tip dry some times more so than the waterbased stuff.
But I have found mixing 1 drop W 500 with 2 drop W100 gives me better results.
I knew I could count on you Herb! I'm going to give that mix of both reducers a try. I know tip dry is inevitable, but after all the hype I've seen and read about the W500, while I didn't expect it to miraculously eliminate it, I was expecting a marked improvement. I do think the other benefits are great though.
 
I hadn't heard that wmlepage. I might give it a try just in the interest of being thorough, but like you I mix on the fly, and to be honest I'm probably too impatient to do that all the time.

I just add about 10%-ish reducer to each color right when I open the new bottle. Saves some time waiting for the W100 to cook in, plus thats usually right about where I like the consistency to be.

Mr. Micron- I'll have to try mixing the W500 and W100 trick. It's probably better than wasting all that W100 I have on the shelf as an airbrush cleaner. lol.
 
I forgot to mention that Draggin, I found less separation too, and also with some colours, I found the W100 would settle at the bottom of the cup, leaving the paint sat on top of it. The W500 is much better in that department.

I knew I could count on you Herb! I'm going to give that mix of both reducers a try. I know tip dry is inevitable, but after all the hype I've seen and read about the W500, while I didn't expect it to miraculously eliminate it, I was expecting a marked improvement. I do think the other benefits are great though.

I just add about 10%-ish reducer to each color right when I open the new bottle. Saves some time waiting for the W100 to cook in, plus thats usually right about where I like the consistency to be.

Mr. Micron- I'll have to try mixing the W500 and W100 trick. It's probably better than wasting all that W100 I have on the shelf as an airbrush cleaner. lol.

I forget who at either Coast Airbrush or Createx told me to do that .
Plus on my bottle of W500 it reads reduce with W100??
 
I had similar results. I'm just not sold.
I have used every single type of paint createx sells and I guess I suck because I can't make them work. In my airbrush that is. I like auto air when sprayed through my mini gun.

I have used etac and just got some trident. Both of those a I just put it in the AB and start painting. Clean the tip every so often and after an hour or so take the needle out and wipe it off.

I have seen amazing work done with createx so I know someone makes it work but not me.
 
Ahh, to be honest I didn't pay much attention to the label, as I thought they all said the same, I vaguely recall The W100 saying the same thing, to reduce with W100, but that's probably just me, jumping in with both feet as usual, without checking it out properly. I would never have thought to try that so thanks Herb, your shining armour is shinier than ever!
 
I had similar results. I'm just not sold.
I have used every single type of paint createx sells and I guess I suck because I can't make them work. In my airbrush that is. I like auto air when sprayed through my mini gun.

I have used etac and just got some trident. Both of those a I just put it in the AB and start painting. Clean the tip every so often and after an hour or so take the needle out and wipe it off.

I have seen amazing work done with createx so I know someone makes it work but not me.
I was the same with the Devilbiss DAGR, people loved it, but I had problem after problem, and even when it was finally sorted couldn't work with it. Switched to Iwata hp-cs, and boom, something clicked. I guess some products just suit people better than others.
 
I forget who at either Coast Airbrush or Createx told me to do that .
Plus on my bottle of W500 it reads reduce with W100??

I haven't read the bottle, but Dennis DeLorenzo and I talked about the Illustration Colors and the HP Reducer for a while when I met him in Orlando. He told me there was no need to mix.
He did say that Illustration White and Black require less reducer than the other colors because there is already some in them along with more solvent. I did have better luck with Illustration White straight out of the bottle than any other white I have used.
 
I found some 100 in my stash today and got all excited! I didn't swear one time while AB with wicked black. Minimal tip dry. Friend of mine came into store tonight, (old school ab guy) he told me to use 1-2 drops of gas and I wont have tip dry. No, maybe not, but I will be too high to notice Lmao
 
Ok, I've been using the w500 for almost a month now. There are some tricks to using it. Yes, if you mix ahead (at least 15 minutes, go have a cup o joe n a smoke and it'll be right as rain) it works much better in the detail department.

As Draggin suggested, put a little bit in your next brand new or existing bottle of paint. Doesn't have to be to the consistency you're used to spraying, just enough to get the paint loosened up.

You don't need as much as you are used to using with w100. Seriously. I've gotten better results using less reducer than I did with w100.

It washes out of your cup better with water than with window cleaner etc.

It Does eliminate mottling or pigment migration. A big pain in the patootie especially if you're laying it on hot n heavy. Yes you still need to lay it down in light layers, but you don't run the risk of ruining an entire project and having to sand it all back to the beginning if you do accidentally blast it on there.

If you're doing outside stuff or don't have a way to cool off your garage or work area, this stuff is AWESOME!! I've been working on that mural and last year had to use w100, if the temperature got above 95 the paint would actually start to dry in the cup and it wouldn't stick to the wall as it was already dry by the time it got there, tip dry was bloody murder. Using the w500 has meant I don't have to pack up n go home if the temperature goes into the triple digits. The paint stays delightfully sprayable even at those temps. (Even if I don't. LOL)


Another thing people are clamoring on and on and ON about is tip dry....... ANY and I do mean ANY PIGMENTED paint will have tip dry to one extent or another. There is NO getting around that PERIOD. The little particles of pigment collect on the needle, air dries that as it passes over it and the blob gets bigger and bigger until cussing ensues. And counter intuitive to what everyone tells you, a good friend told me that if the tip dry is too obnoxious, bump your PSI up a little bit. It'll blow off the crud before it forms a nasty ball. It won't eliminate it but hey, if tip dry was my only issue then it's a good day.

Oh and one more thing, any artist quality paint (oils, acrylics, etc.) uses the same nomenclature for their colors as Wicked Detail does. Whether it's Holbein, Golden or any other good quality artist paint. They use the pigment names, not the silly ones like "porn star pink" or "sunshine yellow" etc.
I like it that way because if it says "burnt sienna" I know what color that is supposed to be. I don't have to guess if it's grey brown or reddish brown or etc. It's pretty much consistent across the board. Just sayin.

Is the w500 the end all be all of reducers? Probably not. But it is an improvement. I'm pretty sure that there will be more improvements as time goes on with feedback from the customer. So let's take it for what it's worth. It's got its good points and places that need improving.

Just sayin'
 
Thanks Biker Granny, I'm def going to add some to my paint bottles, I'm too impatient to wait 15 mins between colour changes, patience is NOT one of my virtues LOL! As far as the tip dry goes, I tried working at higher pressure and found I got tip dry more quickly, and figured more air dried the paint quicker, maybe I just didn't have it up high enough to blow off. I find more reducer and lower air works better for me, and is more controllable too. I guess it's horses for courses. But my one gripe with the W500 is that they say it "practically eliminates" tip dry, well I'd like to know their definition of "practically", I don't notice any difference. Tip dry is just the way it is, and you don't even notice it after a while, until you buy a product that's supposed to dramatically improve it. At the moment I'm just super aware of it, as I was expecting more from the product description. I love it's other qualities, which are a vast improvement over the W100, but if you're going to buy it solely for reducing tip dry IMO, there is no difference.
 
Bikergranny, sir, you just sold me the thing!

Here in the SE of Spain (Murcia) we are having temperatures in excess of 95F (35C), and with a reduction of 2:1 (w100 reducer:wicked detail black) I can spray almost three seconds before having a huge blob of dry paint in the tip of my AB. I can go further in reduction, reduce pressure (I'm currently working with 35psi) and make it some 10 seconds, but then I'll have dry paint in my cup. It's nearly impossible to paint in this conditions. You can literally see the paint drying in the tip of the airbrush while you spray. It's fearsome!.

Now I need to know where can I get some of that wondrous juice. Spraypal doesn't have it, as well ass the few stores in Spain, that I know, specialized in airbrush.
 
I just got some w500 and I would say that it does spray somewhat better, altough I still have to test it more. I'veread, though, that paint shelf life after reducing with w500 is limited to 72h, so beware If you plan to add some straight in your paint bottle. Don't know you, but a bottle always last me well over that.
 
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